By the way, should anyone look in here some time later and wonder about Brave... I got a little help in their forums today and was told that while the linked version above will install for my antique machine, and do some stuff (like what I needed!), it's not "supported" for anything earlier than Mac OS 10.15, as of 2024.

Meaning of course that not everything works the way it would if... my computer were newer. (Ay-yi!) And it won't get better.

It does what it needs to, at this moment. No complaints at all. Upwork's being a pain with infinite captchas, calling me inhuman repeatedly—but now, I can get past it.

Kelly_E I have seen the newer behaviour (which is crap, but I get the bot-scraping protection angle), but haven't had the cloudflare page becoming unresponsive. Brave Browser on Mojave, mostly.

    Kelly_E With all this partitioning talk, I'm wondering whether I could put a newer OS (& browser) on an external HD and make the computer work for me a while longer that way. Isn't that very similar to a partition?

    Yes, you could do that, and with OCLP installed only on the external drive. You have USB3 on the 2012 Pro apparently, so it might be ok with an SSD in a cheap USB3 enclosure. A bit better in a Thunderbolt setup.

      • Robin

      • Post #50
      • Edited
      • GB

      Kelly_E It seems to call every website (so far, 15 min playing with it) "not secure" and I have to override it, but since I virtually never do anything I don't understand fully, I'll have to go with that.

      Glad to help! Glad that works.

      The unsecure website thing is a TLS issue. Remember SSL (Secure Sockets Layer)?

      Yeah, well that's now called TLS (Transport Layer Security), only nobody told you 😄. And nobody told El Cap.

      You're reminding me that I faced this issue with my 2011 Air with El Capitan, which I did fix. Can't remember how I did so, so I'm re-googling it. If I can whittle it down into some simple steps for you, I'll post back onto the thread.

        • Robin

        • Post #51
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        • GB

        Ok, let's also accept this new-fangled lazy-bones AI land we now all live in… and get a little help from ChatGPT (in any case, it's all about knowing the right questions to ask… ammiright?).

        A question for you: does Safari complain about non-secure websites? Or no? If not, could just be Brave settings…. try the below.

        (this means type brave://flags into Brave's address bar)

          Robin Safari also does it, has for a few years.

          I only use Safari for a few things these days since Firefox mostly works. but yeah, that's been going on for a while and obviously, I knew that was the computer, not all the sites. :-)

            Well, folks, that was fun... but now Upwork on the Brave browser is on an infinite Cloudflare human-verification loop that's causing the same problem... on Firefox, the Upwork/ Cloudflare captcha box wouldn't even load, but on Brave it loads, I check it, it says verification successful... and then it loops back and does it again.

            It's definitely Upwork because I passed Cloudflare's own (exact same) verification page easily, just to see if there was anything they could do about it.

            Cloudflare is no stranger to this problem, according to their forums, but I take it they don't have much they can do about it on their end. Web searches say UW has probably over-tightened their security. But when I talk to Support, all they keep parroting is that it's me.

            So the wait resumes. Aaargh.

            Will say that I'm still enjoying Brave, though. insert half a smile here

              • MariaT

              • Post #54
              • Edited
              • ES

              Kelly_E Well, I submitted a ticket to support. After explaining what was happening to me three times (they kept telling me they felt like I had an error, and me telling them it wasn't an error), I managed to get someone to understand what I was asking them (I'm going to attribute this to my poor English).
              Here's a screenshot of their response.
              I haven't cleared the cache. I would only do so if I absolutely have to. The other points are of no use to me.

                That is exactly the response they gave to me last week. Maybe word for word! (After a runaround of several messages back-and-forth.)

                And like you, most of it doesn’t even apply to me. I did clear my cache, and all that did was mess up a bunch of other stuff.

                Then they finally told me they’re getting the report from many people, starting on the same day—a pretty clear indication that it’s their problem, not ours—yet they’re apparently content to archive the tickets and pretend that users giving up on the conversations means it’s fixed.

                When I can do some basic research on the web and read about the issue, it would be nice if they’d do the same.

                  Kelly_E I responded to the message telling them that nothing has worked and that it must be "their" problem.
                  I've also read more complaints about it.
                  Let's see what they say.

                    I too encounter the Cloudflare captcha when I open an RFP.

                    Here is a thread from Reddit:

                      Ravi That's UNBELIEVABLE—so at the time, about a week ago, when I started a ticket and told them everything about the problem sounded like it was them, not me—at least one of those Redditors says they had put in a ticket a whole week before that!!!

                      Why, oh why do they try so hard to make every individual think they're at fault, instead of admitting there's a larger issue on their end and fixing it?

                          Kelly_E Why, oh why do they try so hard to make every individual think they're at fault, instead of admitting there's a larger issue on their end and fixing it?

                          Because the Upwork management would eat them alive.

                            • Robin

                            • Post #61
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                            • GB

                            Kelly_E Why, oh why do they try so hard to make every individual think they're at fault, instead of admitting there's a larger issue on their end and fixing it?

                            I think Upwork became more and more of a narcissistic organisation in the last few years. Generally speaking though, Customer Support – in particular in the tech world – seems to have gone more and more this way over a decade or so.

                            I couldn't imagine keeping customers if this is how I'd handled support tickets back in the day – back in the old software on-premises days, we'd have lost every customer if we'd have dealt with them this way.

                            There's some combination going on of generational change, shortened attention spans, the switch to cloud, the reliance on platforms, and essentially a forgetting of really good support/service skills. We used to go the extra mile for our customers – always. Now support people barely even put their boots on; issue is chucked straight back over the fence as a method of getting rid.

                            I wouldn't accept it if I hired support people.

                              Upwork has long felt that their platform is indispensable.

                              Recently, more so.

                              • Robin

                              • Post #63
                              • Edited
                              • GB

                              Did you try this step btw Kelly?

                              (Their annoying Cloudflare thing works for me on Brave in Mojave; I still think this is a TLS issue, but a little odd that it initially worked for you in Brave and now does not.)

                                  Robin I did attempt to, but the flags page doesn't have exactly that, so I didn't like to go forward.

                                  When I look for TLS on the page, all I see is this:

                                  And my choices are Default, Enabled, or Disabled. No mention of TLS types/versions... or support...

                                    I have the latest. 78.15.

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