Sending proposals for work below your profile rate?

Kelly_E

Folks, I'm wondering what insights you have on having an hourly rate on Upwork that's higher than a project you decide to bid on... and bidding within their range anyway.

So for instance:

Let's say my rate is $109/ hr. (It isn't.) And even expert jobs don't come along in my field much higher than $75/ hr on Upwork. (This is sad, but often true.)

——Upwork-wise, does bidding $69/ hr on a job when your profile rate is $109 do anything to the proposal? Does it bury it? Does it move it to the top?——

I know it probably makes a proposal look weak or at least odd to the prospective client, unless you clarify it amazingly well in your message. But I'm just asking about any experience or insight people might have with the Upwork algorithm, not with client reactions.

——Secondarily: Does bidding $109/ hr (for instance) on a job when the range is up to $75/ hr do anything? I presume this does bury it. Anyone know for sure?——

This is more for curiosity than anything else. I'm not sure I would ever bother to do either of these... my view rate is dismal enough anyway, why throw away connects? But I've started thinking about raising my rates elsewhere, and then I wondered—if I raised 'em on UW but continued send proposals for the same listings I'd send proposals for today, what would happen?

——Third question I just thought of: Does having high, truly expert-level rates (for Upwork) do anything interesting to invites/ cold contacts?——

My rates are somewhat high for Upwork, positioning me where I want to be on the site—but not at all what top practitioners can get in my field when working for top, established businesses. I usually work with startups and small-to-mid-size businesses, and there's a ceiling to what their budgets can handle—no matter how much they want what I can do for them.

Thoughts?

Alexandra

Kelly_E I don't know about UW, but I once did this -- bidding lower -- on another platform (writing it off as marketing expenditure) to see what would happen. Apparently, the client didn't quite believe it because his first (and only) question to me was: How many hours will you need? But he must have seen my proposal.

Eve

I don't care about the hourly range on job posts. I've never seen anyone in my niche post a job with a range that includes my rate. Then again, I don't really send proposals anyway. But I get invites, and often, the client hires me for my rate, although it's double the maximum range when I look at the job post.

When I used to hire a lot on Upwork, I didn't set a range for an hourly rate, so I don't know what happens to proposals that are outside of the chosen minimum and maximum rates. On a side note, I think setting a range is just stupid. Once, when this was done by a colleague of mine, she was then complaining that all freelancers bid the max of the stated range, even when the freelancer's profile rate was much lower.

Personally, I think that having a much higher rate than most others in your niche is a positive thing as long as you've gotten work, preferably long-term or a high-value contract. Several of my clients have told me that the fact that I'm expensive and have a large amount earned on Upwork was why they reached out to me. They see it as some kind of evidence that I'm good at what I do. I think this applies particularly to clients that have, in the past, hired a lot of cheaper freelancers and not been happy with the results.

On my profile, my hourly projects are all over the place in terms of rate. I have different rates for writing and other kinds of work, but I also often use hourly contracts as a way of billing for fixed-rate jobs. For example, I can have contracts with an hourly rate that equals 500 or 1000 words of writing. So I just add the hours manually, based on how much I've written for a client throughout the week. Never had a client comment on that or ask me why I supposedly work for some clients for $60 per hour while I charge more than double that for others.

Kelly_E

Eve You're tempting me!!
...
...
ETA: I went for it. Considered whether I should simply go to a more 2025 rate, or whether I should go slightly eye-popping to see if it changes the character of invites I get... decided on "a more 2025 rate" although I checked what's currently eye-popping for others doing brand work & I was super-tempted to go eye-popping and see if more serious clients are out there wishing for me but not finding me because I'm not at the top of the price list...

Ugh, pricing is such a hornets-nest.

Mark

Kelly_E I am in complete agreement with Eve, which is not and never will be, a surprise. I don't care about the rates that are posted on the job, and for hourly Upwork suggest a range of rates and I suspect a lot of clients just take that because how the f would they know what it should be. But I would further suggest that Upwork doesn't know what it should be and, in fact, there is no should be.

There is a pretentious asshole on reddit that says your rate can be whatever you can sell. I don't know if he is right or not but I think the point is you won't know until you try to sell it. But the first key to selling anything, IMO, is you have to believe it.

So I would suggest to you that your new rate is not eye-popping it is what you f'n deserve because you are a badass freelance warrior. You have seen the competition out there and you know that you would destroy that. I am not a visualize it and it will become all is harmony in the universe kind of person but I have to say you can't convince anyone if you can't convince yourself.

Eve

Kelly_E If I were to guess, I would assume the best price point would be around 50% more than average. I'm thinking it sets you apart from the rest, at the same time as it might not be too far above the average client's budget. However, since there is no average for any of this, if we also take skill into consideration, I'm clearly just making all of this up. But to me, it would make sense.

I had a look at my competition on Upwork, and I still have the highest profile rate of anyone in my niche who has actually made any money. However, if you're looking to onboard several new clients, I wouldn't recommend that pricing strategy. I typically only take on 1 or 2 new clients per year, other than short and small one-offs. The vast majority of clients would never consider hiring someone that expensive when there are so many cheaper options. So if you were to try that, I would recommend that you do that when you don't need the work.

However, keep in mind that I'm just making stuff up as I go along. Other than my own experience I have nothing to base any of this on. I've done all the "wrong" things on Upwork at some point or another and then just figured out what works for me from thereon out. Haha!

Kelly_E

Mark 1. That's so sweet & affirming... can you come live inside my brain?

After 18+ years doing this, I already suspect I come across as a teensy bit forceful (not arrogant, just sure!) about my value... now you want me to think badass thoughts and consider going all the way to a no-that's-not-eye-popping rate? I worry this forum may create a monster!!

Kelly_E

Eve Hee hee—everybody's making it up as we go along!

I would assume the best price point would be around 50% more than average

Yeah, that's probably what I just bumped to. With your temptation!

I think it's right for me for 2025... not what I could get elsewhere if every star aligned, not what I'd like to see happening on UW (if every star aligned...)—but every star doesn't always align!

Mark

Kelly_E

That's so sweet & affirming... can you come live inside my brain?
I don't even live like that inside my brain nor am I usually consider sweet or affirming. But I do believe in engaging maximum ego when doing this. There is already a infinite supply of people willing to tell you that you can't do it, that it can't be done, and that you are not good enough, why would I want to join that crowd.

TopRatedTroll

I always bid my rate but I admit I get rejected a lot because of it.

AJ The Upworker

I've almost completely stopped submitting cold proposals, but when I do, I also don't care what rate is posted on a job and just submit a proposal with my standard rate. That said, if a job is posted with a 'peanuts' rate, or if the client has a long history of paying peanuts then I just don't bother wasting my time submitting a proposal.

TopRatedTroll

AJ The Upworker The long history plus 5 star feedback for cheap writers stops me from bidding too. They are apparently happy with cheap stuff so they won't suddenly want something expensive. Invites are a different thing though. I have nothing to lose bidding on those.