Direct contact but no meeting

Robin · 30 Jan

Something which happens on Upwork on occasion:

I get a direct contact. Client seems strongly interested. We discuss. All seems well. A meeting is suggested. I drop a meeting link. Client drops their interest and goes completely cold, sometimes with some further meeting-arrangey awkwardness, but no actual meeting scheduled.

So what was their intention when picking a freelancer out to sound out their interest / availability?

Well maybe they had the same conversation with some other freelancers 🤷‍♂️

Only one of these direct contacts has ever come to anything. All others ended in some kind of the above unexplainable weirdness (one of which went on for about two months, and seemed to be a game being played by that business owner – we were in phone contact but it had become a no-contract-as-promised situation by then… and in the end I told him in no uncertain terms to stuff it).

On the one hand, it's nice to receive direct contacts. On the other… it's not hard to schedule a meeting. And so I'm left wondering what the game is.

I was wondering what other Upworkers' experiences are with being directly contacted by clients? Are you faring any better? Do you have a strategy for approaching these types of contact? (Please please why would I need a strategy to simply converse with a person and arrange a meeting?? 😢)

Eve · 30 Jan

I often get direct contacts from clients, and many of them turn into contracts. If the project is not a good fit for me I just tell the client it's better if they find another freelancer.

Thinking about it, it seems that most clients who contact me directly through Upwork don't even know what they're looking for. A lot of them are just people with too much money who think they're going to make even more money by entering the industry I'm in, without knowing anything about it. When I ask them to tell me about their project and what they need, it turns out to be something not at all related to what I do. Often, I then end up guiding them in the direction they need to go in, explaining what kind of role it is they actually need to fill so they can post a job for it. After this free advice, it's happened several times that the client then contacts me again when they actually need the services that I provide.

Kelly_E · 30 Jan

Robin I've gotten so many direct contacts, and responses to proposals, where the client and I set up a Zoom meeting and then——
(a) they don't show or
(b) they ask me one question and end the convo— "How much?" —which I ALWAYS address in my written proposal or first written contact... meaning they already have the answer—AND to double-check, when setting up a meeting I always ask whether there's anything I could simply answer right now in the discussion thread, so if that's all there is we could have dealt with it right away

——that I'm basically call-averse now. About 50%+ don't show, and never contact me again. About 40%+ ask how much. Only 10%... maybe less... are real conversations.

90% are my time wasted, so I try super-hard not to do calls now.

If anyone knows what's up beyond "people are all raised by wolves now and have no feeling for the person on the other side of the screen," I'd sure be interested.

Robin · 30 Jan

Eve That's a good approach if the client, like some of your direct ones, don't initially understand what they need. Nice that they come back to you later.

In my case the contacts have been a good match for what they need & to my skills. And then they don't meet. I'm honestly bewildered. Quite possibly I am saying something wrong! Or perhaps it's a numbers game in the background and someone else got a meeting quicker. I have no idea.

I'm thinking I'll retain more of an air of mystery next time. Say little in messages, let them have to have a meeting. Keep it short & sweet. Meet, connect, decide on the call to go forwards, tell them I'll propose a contract, gently push them to accept it (Ok I have a strategy…).

I did have to do that a bit in the past after some interviews went well… maybe I am just out of practice at being skilfully pushy 😅

Eve · 30 Jan

Robin Whenever a potential client wants to book a meeting, I always give them homework to do before we meet. Like, send me information about budget, target market, business plan, in-house resources, or whatever else I need to fully understand what they're trying to accomplish. Maybe a list of tasks makes them think they have to do the meeting? I don't know. I've never had a client not show up. (Except for a consultation, but I got paid anyway, so that wasn't a problem for me.)

Eve · 30 Jan

Kelly_E 90% are my time wasted, so I try super-hard not to do calls now.

Same. Unless there's some complicated thing that has to be discussed over a call, I try to avoid it. There's all too often a good portion of a meeting just wasted in pleasantries and other stuff that's not even related to the project, and then lots of people just ramble on for 10 minutes about something they could have told me in a 1 paragraph message.

Not to mention all the time wasted to fix myself up so I'm presentable for a video call. Ugh.

Kelly_E · 30 Jan

Eve >>Not to mention all the time wasted to fix myself up so I'm presentable for a video call. Ugh.

AMEN!

Alexandra · 31 Jan

Robin I have to make a confession (but don't tell UW) at this point: I generally don't reply to pointless messages like 'Hi, I hope you are doing well' followed by...nothing. I don't go in for 'Are you there?' message exchanges (I guess it's a generational thing), and it's not too much to ask the client to state briefly why they are contacting you (e.g. 'Hi, can we discuss...?').

Robin · 31 Jan

Thanks for the responses. In particular:

Eve I always give them homework to do before we meet. Like, send me information about budget, target market, business plan, in-house resources, or whatever else I need to fully understand what they're trying to accomplish

... gives me something to think about.

I think there has maybe been a disconnect between my profile, the view clients have in mind of me after reading it, and what I perceive (or do not) about those things.

I hadn't even looked at my main profile for a year. I just re-wrote it (turns out badly needed); it's now much more punchy and to the point, and quickly hits all the right points. So I now I ought to have a good idea of what potential clients are thinking about my experience & level when they contact me, and I will wear that mind-suit when they do so.

No need for me to convince them any further as the profile (and demos to be added) should have done it. So then it's effectively... after some brief courtesies and project details... book or do not book a meeting.

Eve · 31 Jan

Robin The key is to tell the client, without telling them, that they need you more than you need them. They contacted you because they need your expertise, so they need to book a meeting and then do x, y, and z. If they do, you can help them solve whatever it is that needs solving.

I know for myself that it's much easier for me to blow off meetings when there's no clear agenda and specific topics that need to be discussed or solved. Meetings just to "let's have a chat and see where that takes us" quickly fall off my priority list.

Robin · 31 Jan

Eve The key is to tell the client, without telling them, that they need you more than you need them. They contacted you because they need your expertise, so they need to book a meeting and then do x, y, and z

Yes, exactly… this is where I'm headed with it after my profile update, and possibly what went wrong in my interaction with this prospect. I can fall too much into selling myself. But that's what a good profile should do (and had in the past).

So I now don't have to do that. And I can add a request for project overview, existing systems, priorities, get them to give me a good understanding of their needs. Thanks for planting that bit in my head. It reminded me that I created a couple of fillable PDFs a while back for establishing these details. That would be pretty good to lead with.

Petra · 3 Feb

Robin

I drop a meeting link

What kind of "meeting link"? The only kind of meeting you can have until you're hired is an Upwork meeting.

we were in phone contact

That's not allowed either.

Robin · 3 Feb

Petra What kind of "meeting link"? The only kind of meeting you can have until you're hired is an Upwork meeting.

An Upwork one 🙂 A scheduling link.

Petra we were in phone contact

That's not allowed either.

Yeah, this was that particular client's way of pulling me away from Upwork despite repeatedly promising to go through Upwork (which after I insisted, and we did a very small milestone, he then reneged on, so he then 'benefited' from my (final) thoughts (thorough roasting) on another of his preferred phone calls).

His process of trying to pull me into his own contract lasted about two months. These clients really are a complete waste of time. And I never felt his client actually existed (booked me to physically see the client without telling me where they were located or their company name 😳).

It was like it was all some sort of twisted and demonic game.

In any case, I did not realise the Upwork police were around here 😅

Petra · 3 Feb

Robin

In any case, I did not realise the Upwork police were around here

No need for the insult.
It has nothing to do with "the Upwork police" and everything to do with Upwork currently getting super strict with this stuff and suspending people left, right and center.

Robin · 3 Feb

Petra You missed the emote. Light joshing, no insult intended.

Upwork can feel free to ban the guy. I pulled him towards the platform at every opportunity, including the setting up of a contract.

Petra · 3 Feb

OK :) Fair enough.

Robin · 10 Feb

This became:

Meeting -> Interview -> Verbal offer of a Contract -> Contract Offer window passed without comms

Back in the dark until there's another crack of light...

(I should remember that I don't communicate much when I'm in the depths & busy 😄)

(I literally this instant just had a message from another client, telling me he's just gotten around to reading my messages from 3 weeks ago and will consider it 🤣)

ugh think I just gotta leave people to it!

Sidenote: If I got my Kolbe score I think I'd be a QuickStart...

Robin · 11 Feb

It's easy to feel gaslit in these situations, and find I have to place the negative version of events into superposition and not act on it.

Some people have a habit of making you question whether you'd want to work with them, and also, if I'm being self-respecting… does this feel acceptable?

Antoher one of those unpleasant sides of freelancing.

Robin · 12 Feb

Decided not to even propose a contract.

Dude can lick my boots.

These direct contact episodes are not half strange.

i'm not going to be personable in response to these anymore. It's going to be: you hire me or you don't hire me.

Some of that goes back to @Eve's post – get some concrete info, decide whether I can / want to do it, give a start date and a rate and give the client 24 hours to hire.

Robin · 26 Feb

Update on this...

Sent the guy a message saying that it would have been appropriate for me to have proposed a contract shortly after our discussion, where we agreed to enter into one, but it probably wasn't appropriate of me to do that 1 week later, after no replies from himself for several days.

Never heard anything. Dude apparently really wanted to work with me when we were on our call, but I must say something about it struck me as distinctly unreal on that call.

I've had numerous of these experiences of 'unreal' connections & requests on Upwork. Looking at this forum, others have too.

I don't know whether this is always the behaviour of real clients, or something else quite frankly.